Comments on: Are Web Analytics Easy or Hard? http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/are-web-analytics-easy-or-hard Wed, 03 Aug 2011 17:03:17 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: Akin Arikan http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/are-web-analytics-easy-or-hard/comment-page-1#comment-146 Akin Arikan Thu, 27 Aug 2009 05:52:55 +0000 http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/?p=201#comment-146 Thanks everyone for the well taken comments! ... Jonny is certainly right to point out that many buyers of web analytics systems expect answers out of the tool instead of reports. Let alone doing analysis! The difference between reporting and analysis is only an insider topic anyway, as far as I know. Not sure whether somebody out of business school would necessarily know what the difference is. ... Benoit's comment speaks to the passion that we all see of trying to make our work really matter. Creating anything that matters seems really hard work and rarely seems to fit in a 40 hours work week. As for the potential "analytics mirages", I ran into them too while writing the "easy" bullets in the post and had to work to constrain the points. ... Petri says we may all be in danger of going insane. What is happening here though because this question is clearly drawing our attention? ... Rene, Wow, excellent analogy! I gotta remember that one. During the radio show the host had another good analogy: Pen and paper are easy to use too but that doesn't make everyone a good author. Smart guy, he was getting at the same point. Can't wait to see the home warming party reviews for your new place in Madrid! .... Shwe, raises another great point about speaking with execs which is definitely not easy but hard. These guys are not dumb. They may not know the inner workings of the WWW bu sure want their information concise and we must be able to substantiate and defend our advice. Not easy! ... Jacques, Good point. But why actually? Is every web site different? Would it be possible to create an expert system for the 4 - 5 site types out there that recommends how to trouble shoot each KPI? ... Thanks again Akin Thanks everyone for the well taken comments!
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Jonny is certainly right to point out that many buyers of web analytics systems expect answers out of the tool instead of reports. Let alone doing analysis! The difference between reporting and analysis is only an insider topic anyway, as far as I know. Not sure whether somebody out of business school would necessarily know what the difference is.
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Benoit’s comment speaks to the passion that we all see of trying to make our work really matter. Creating anything that matters seems really hard work and rarely seems to fit in a 40 hours work week. As for the potential “analytics mirages”, I ran into them too while writing the “easy” bullets in the post and had to work to constrain the points.
…
Petri says we may all be in danger of going insane. What is happening here though because this question is clearly drawing our attention?
…
Rene,
Wow, excellent analogy! I gotta remember that one. During the radio show the host had another good analogy: Pen and paper are easy to use too but that doesn’t make everyone a good author. Smart guy, he was getting at the same point. Can’t wait to see the home warming party reviews for your new place in Madrid!
….
Shwe,
raises another great point about speaking with execs which is definitely not easy but hard. These guys are not dumb. They may not know the inner workings of the WWW bu sure want their information concise and we must be able to substantiate and defend our advice. Not easy!
…
Jacques,
Good point. But why actually? Is every web site different? Would it be possible to create an expert system for the 4 – 5 site types out there that recommends how to trouble shoot each KPI?
…
Thanks again
Akin

]]> By: Jacques Warren http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/are-web-analytics-easy-or-hard/comment-page-1#comment-145 Jacques Warren Thu, 27 Aug 2009 00:45:49 +0000 http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/?p=201#comment-145 Man! I've been doing this for tooo long to find it easy. You know me, the more I think about even what's supposed to be the easy, simple stuff, the more I challenge its validity. Man! I’ve been doing this for tooo long to find it easy. You know me, the more I think about even what’s supposed to be the easy, simple stuff, the more I challenge its validity.

]]> By: Twitter Trackbacks for Multichannel Marketing Metrics with Akin » Are Web Analytics Easy or Hard? [multichannelmetrics.com] on Topsy.com http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/are-web-analytics-easy-or-hard/comment-page-1#comment-144 Twitter Trackbacks for Multichannel Marketing Metrics with Akin » Are Web Analytics Easy or Hard? [multichannelmetrics.com] on Topsy.com Wed, 26 Aug 2009 21:30:08 +0000 http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/?p=201#comment-144 [...] link is being shared on Twitter right now. @jonnylongden, an influential author, said Is #measure easy [...] [...] link is being shared on Twitter right now. @jonnylongden, an influential author, said Is #measure easy [...]

]]> By: Shwe http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/are-web-analytics-easy-or-hard/comment-page-1#comment-143 Shwe Wed, 26 Aug 2009 14:36:40 +0000 http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/?p=201#comment-143 IMHO, Web Analytics requires a lot of thought. Thinking is not easy. No, i'm not kidding. And if you need a statistician to think for you, well you're in real trouble then. Google Analytics is a tool, nothing more and nothing less. Its a LOT better than the way I first learned to do web analytics (AWK, PERL, Excel, Powerpoint, rinse, repeat, etc...). But GA is never going to think for you. One approach is to put a few key questions into a bucket - some deep, some easy . Then take that bucket and pitch it to your boss/client/community as a project. Answer all the questions and come up with recommendations. Only give your boss/client/community the answers and recommendations. I mean, show them a report if they ask or demand one...but ultimately people want answers not reports. Your boss/client/community wants someone to think through the deep questions for him/her. Its Akin's job to make it look easy, which he clearly does :) IMHO, Web Analytics requires a lot of thought. Thinking is not easy. No, i’m not kidding.

And if you need a statistician to think for you, well you’re in real trouble then.

Google Analytics is a tool, nothing more and nothing less. Its a LOT better than the way I first learned to do web analytics (AWK, PERL, Excel, Powerpoint, rinse, repeat, etc…). But GA is never going to think for you.

One approach is to put a few key questions into a bucket – some deep, some easy . Then take that bucket and pitch it to your boss/client/community as a project. Answer all the questions and come up with recommendations. Only give your boss/client/community the answers and recommendations. I mean, show them a report if they ask or demand one…but ultimately people want answers not reports.

Your boss/client/community wants someone to think through the deep questions for him/her. Its Akin’s job to make it look easy, which he clearly does :)

]]> By: René Dechamps Otamendi http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/are-web-analytics-easy-or-hard/comment-page-1#comment-142 René Dechamps Otamendi Wed, 26 Aug 2009 11:29:23 +0000 http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/?p=201#comment-142 Hi Akin, Good post and yes the debate is still open ;-) I remember two years and a half ago at eMetrics, Aurélie and I were sitting at lunch with some of the most renowned Bloggers in Web Analytics and we had a discussion around this debate, Eric was already stating back then that Web Analytics was hard (he's done a few presentations on that topic these past years) while Avinash was disagreeing slightly, not saying that Web Analytics was easy but stating that it was complex. My two cents are that Web analytics can seem easy and it's easy to get started with tools like Google Analytics, but it gets more complex further down the road and yes it can get really hard, but this as all disciplines. I like to compare Web Analytics to cooking, where the tools are the kitchens and the analysts are the cooks. Well, for some people it's easy to cook in any kitchen, while others struggle just to understand how appliance X or Y works... So if you have the correct mindset (I don't believe that anybody can be a Web Analyst) it can be easier, but if you want to make a soufflé, well it's not going to be easy, specially the first times ;-) To end this analogy I always state that I'd rather have a good cook in a simple kitchen than a bad cook in a very sophisticated one. And let's be honest Web Analytics tools aren't as easy as vendors (and now I'm one so I measure my words ;-)) try to present them. As everything good in life, it takes time to be good at it and use it properly. With time you'll find it easier but if you're trying to integrate your online data with your offline data for instance it can be hard or complex (pick the one you prefer). Of course tools are important if you're trying to do things like that and you have tools that make your life easier than others (and Unica is in the first group in this example). Cheers from Sunny Madrid and please pay us a visit next time you come to Spain. Cheers, René Hi Akin,

Good post and yes the debate is still open ;-) I remember two years and a half ago at eMetrics, Aurélie and I were sitting at lunch with some of the most renowned Bloggers in Web Analytics and we had a discussion around this debate, Eric was already stating back then that Web Analytics was hard (he’s done a few presentations on that topic these past years) while Avinash was disagreeing slightly, not saying that Web Analytics was easy but stating that it was complex.

My two cents are that Web analytics can seem easy and it’s easy to get started with tools like Google Analytics, but it gets more complex further down the road and yes it can get really hard, but this as all disciplines. I like to compare Web Analytics to cooking, where the tools are the kitchens and the analysts are the cooks. Well, for some people it’s easy to cook in any kitchen, while others struggle just to understand how appliance X or Y works… So if you have the correct mindset (I don’t believe that anybody can be a Web Analyst) it can be easier, but if you want to make a soufflé, well it’s not going to be easy, specially the first times ;-) To end this analogy I always state that I’d rather have a good cook in a simple kitchen than a bad cook in a very sophisticated one. And let’s be honest Web Analytics tools aren’t as easy as vendors (and now I’m one so I measure my words ;-) ) try to present them. As everything good in life, it takes time to be good at it and use it properly. With time you’ll find it easier but if you’re trying to integrate your online data with your offline data for instance it can be hard or complex (pick the one you prefer). Of course tools are important if you’re trying to do things like that and you have tools that make your life easier than others (and Unica is in the first group in this example).

Cheers from Sunny Madrid and please pay us a visit next time you come to Spain.

Cheers,

René

]]> By: Petri Mertanen http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/are-web-analytics-easy-or-hard/comment-page-1#comment-141 Petri Mertanen Wed, 26 Aug 2009 10:40:58 +0000 http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/?p=201#comment-141 I think the whole question is kind of insane. I think it's very biased so it depends a lot who you are talking with. And as Akin clearly pointed out you can talk same things and metrics in a very different level. Good post, thanks. I think the whole question is kind of insane. I think it’s very biased so it depends a lot who you are talking with. And as Akin clearly pointed out you can talk same things and metrics in a very different level. Good post, thanks.

]]> By: Benoit Arson http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/are-web-analytics-easy-or-hard/comment-page-1#comment-140 Benoit Arson Wed, 26 Aug 2009 10:05:30 +0000 http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/?p=201#comment-140 Great post about a crucial debate. I really think that web analytics can't be easy. How to be totally sure of what I get from my analysis? Is it the real cause of my website problem? Or do I miss the right insight? I'm afraid that only tackling easy questions drives to misinterpretations. It's essential to go further and analyse all available indicators about an element to get a holistic view. Take the example of a suspicion of a landing page problem. You need to gather all available and useful informations about this landing page. It means that you know which informations are essential (hard). Then, you have to gather all these informations (hard), to display them in a single page (hard) and to analyze them to reveal insights (hard). It reduces risks of mistakes but it takes time and it's hard. But when your insights are taken in account and they improve outcomes, you feel like a world champion! Great post about a crucial debate.
I really think that web analytics can’t be easy.

How to be totally sure of what I get from my analysis?
Is it the real cause of my website problem? Or do I miss the right insight?

I’m afraid that only tackling easy questions drives to misinterpretations.
It’s essential to go further and analyse all available indicators about an element to get a holistic view.

Take the example of a suspicion of a landing page problem.

You need to gather all available and useful informations about this landing page.
It means that you know which informations are essential (hard).
Then, you have to gather all these informations (hard), to display them in a single page (hard) and to analyze them to reveal insights (hard).
It reduces risks of mistakes but it takes time and it’s hard.

But when your insights are taken in account and they improve outcomes, you feel like a world champion!

]]> By: Jonny Longden http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/are-web-analytics-easy-or-hard/comment-page-1#comment-139 Jonny Longden Wed, 26 Aug 2009 08:37:54 +0000 http://www.multichannelmetrics.com/?p=201#comment-139 For me one of the biggest spanners in the works is the fact that web analytics tools make it all 'seem' so easy. If you want to [properly] analyse a customer database, you need a statistician with 5+ years SAS experience - but any idiot can use Google Analytics; as long as you know how to use the internet you know how to use web analysis tools! So the problem is that it IS easy to look at the data, but this makes people forget what analysis actually is. For me one of the biggest spanners in the works is the fact that web analytics tools make it all ‘seem’ so easy. If you want to [properly] analyse a customer database, you need a statistician with 5+ years SAS experience – but any idiot can use Google Analytics; as long as you know how to use the internet you know how to use web analysis tools!

So the problem is that it IS easy to look at the data, but this makes people forget what analysis actually is.

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